THE URGENCY OF CHANGE - 'SUFFERING'/《转变的紧迫性》之“苦难”
THE URGENCY OF CHANGE - 'SUFFERING'《转变的紧迫性》之“苦难”
Questioner: I seem to have suffered a great deal all my life, not physically, but through death and loneliness and the utter futility of my existence. I had a son whom I greatly loved. He died in an accident. My wife left me, and that caused a great deal of pain. I suppose I am like thousands of other middle-class people with sufficient money and a steady job. I'm not complaining of my circumstances but I want to understand what sorrow means, why it comes at all. One has been told that wisdom comes through sorrow, but I have found quite the contrary.
发问者：我的整个一生似乎受尽了苦难，不是身体上的痛苦，而是历经死亡和寂寞，以及我那毫无意义的生存。我有个挚爱的儿子。他死于一次事故。我的妻子离开了我，这带来了巨大的痛苦。我想我就像成千上万的中产阶级一样，有足够的钱和一份稳定的工作。我不是在抱怨我的境遇，而是我想了解悲伤意味着什么，究竟为什么会有悲伤。有人说智慧来自悲伤，但是我发现情况正相反。
Krishnamurti: I wonder what you have learnt from suffering? Have you learnt anything at all? What has sorrow taught you?
Questioner: It has certainly taught me never to be attached to people, and a certain bitterness, a certain aloofness and not to allow my feelings to run away with me. It has taught me to be very careful not to get hurt again.
Krishnamurti: So, as you say, it hasn't taught you wisdom; on the contrary it has made you more cunning, more insensitive. Does sorrow teach one anything at all except the obvious self-protective reactions?
克：我想知道你从苦难中学到了什么？你究竟学到任何东西了吗？悲伤教会了你什么？
发问者：当然，它教我永远不要执着于任何人，教会了我某种苦涩，某种超然，不让我逃避我的感觉。它教我要十分小心不再受伤害。
克：那么，如你所说，它没有教你智慧；相反，它使你变得更狡猾，更不敏感。除了这些明显的自我保护反应，悲伤究竟教你任何东西了吗？
Questioner: I have always accepted suffering as part of my life, but I feel now, somehow, that I'd like to be free of it, free of all the tawdry bitterness and indifference without again going through all the pain of attachment. My life is so pointless and empty, utterly self-enclosed and insignificant. It's a life of mediocrity, and perhaps that mediocrity is the greatest sorrow of all.
发问者：我一直接受痛苦是我生活的一部分，但是我现在觉得，从某种程度上，我想从中解脱出来，摆脱所有世俗的苦难和冷漠，不再经历所有执著的痛苦。我的生命是如此的没有意义和空虚，极其自我封闭和微不足道。这是平庸的生活，也许平庸是最深重的悲伤。
Krishnamurti: There is the personal sorrow and the sorrow of the world. There is the sorrow of ignorance and the sorrow of time. This ignorance is the lack of knowing oneself, and the sorrow of time is the deception that time can cure, heal and change. Most people are caught in that deception and either worship sorrow or explain it away. But in either case it continues, and one never asks oneself if it can come to an end.
克：有个人的悲伤，也有世界的悲伤。有无知的悲伤和时间的悲伤。这种无知是缺乏对自己的认识，时间的悲伤是自欺欺人地认为时间能够治愈，疗伤以及改变。大多数人都被困在这个谎言中，要么礼拜悲伤，要么用解释来打发悲伤。但是，不管用哪种方式，悲伤还是会继续，而人们从来不问问自己悲伤是否能够终止。
Questioner: But I am asking now if it can come to an end, and how? How am I to end it? I understand that it's no good running away from it, or resisting it with bitterness and cynicism. What am I to do to end the grief which I have carried for so long?
发问者：但是我现在就在问，它能否终止，以及怎样才能停止？我要如何停止悲伤？我知道，用苦涩嘲讽和玩世不恭来逃避或者抗拒悲伤没有什么好处。我要怎样才能终止我背负了这么久的悲伤？
Krishnamurti: Self-pity is one of the elements of sorrow. Another element is being attached to someone and encouraging or fostering his attachment to you. Sorrow is not only there when attachment fails you but its seed is in the very beginning of that attachment. In all this the trouble is the utter lack of knowing oneself. Knowing oneself is the ending of sorrow. We are afraid to know ourselves because we have divided ourselves into the good and the bad, the evil and the noble, the pure and the impure. The good is always judging the bad, and these fragments are at war with each other. This war is sorrow. To end sorrow is to see the fact and not invent its opposite, for the opposites contain each other. Walking in this corridor of opposites is sorrow. This fragmentation of life into the high and the low, the noble and the ignoble, God and the Devil, breeds conflict and pain. When there is sorrow, there is no love. Love and sorrow cannot live together.
克：自怜是悲伤的一个因素。另一个因素是执着于某人，并助长或加强他对你的执着。不仅仅是在你所执着的人离你而去的时候才会有悲伤，而是悲伤的种子在执着刚刚开始的时候就已经种下了。这一切的麻烦都来自于对自己极其缺乏了解。了解自己就是悲伤的终结。我们害怕了解自己，因为我们把自己分成了好和坏，邪恶和高尚，纯洁和不纯洁。好的总是在评判坏的，这些碎片在彼此交战。这战争就是悲伤。终结悲伤就是看到这个事实，而不去臆造它的对立面，因为对立面之中就包含着彼此。在这对立面的通道中行走，就是悲伤。把生活分成高的和低的，高尚的和卑微的，上帝和魔鬼，这种支离破碎的划分就滋生了冲突和痛苦。有悲伤就没有爱。爱和悲伤无法共存。
Questioner: Ah! But love can inflict sorrow on another. I may love another and yet bring him sorrow.
Krishnamurti: Do you bring it, if you love, or does he? If another is attached to you, with or without encouragement, and you turn away from him and he suffers, is it you or he who has brought about his suffering?
Questioner: You mean I am not responsible for someone else's sorrow, even if it is on my account? How does sorrow ever end then?
发问者：啊！但是爱会带给别人悲伤。我可能爱上别人，但是也可能给他带来悲伤。
克：如果你爱着，是你带来了悲伤，还是他带来的？如果别人执着于你，不管这执着有没有受到鼓励，然后你离他而去，他就痛苦，那么是你还是他带来了他的痛苦？
发问者：你的意思是我不用为别人的悲伤负责，即使那是由于我的原因？那么悲伤要怎样才能终止？
Krishnamurti: As we have said, it is only in knowing oneself completely that sorrow ends. Do you know yourself at a glance, or hope to after a long analysis? Through analysis you cannot know yourself. You can only know yourself without accumulation, in relationship, from moment to moment. This means that one must be aware, without any choice, of what is actually taking place. It means to see oneself as one is, without the opposite, the ideal, without the knowledge of what one has been. If you look at yourself with the eyes of resentment or rancour then what you see is coloured by the past. The shedding of the past all the time when you see yourself is the freedom from the past. Sorrow ends only when there is the light of understanding, and this light is not lit by one experience or by one flash of understanding; this understanding is lighting itself all the time. Nobody can give it to you - no book, trick, teacher or saviour. The understanding of yourself is the ending of sorrow.
克：正如我们说过的，只有在对自己完全的了解中，悲伤才能终止。你是在一瞥之间就了解了自己，还是希望经过漫长的分析来了解自己？通过分析你无法了解自己。只有一刻接一刻地在关系中，没有任何积累，你才能了解自己。这就意味着你必须没有任何选择地觉察到真实发生着的事情。如果你是在用憎恶或者仇恨的双眼来看自己的话，那么你所看到的就被过去染上了颜色。当你看自己的时候始终能够剥离过去，那就是从过去中解脱了出来。只有当有了这种了解的光芒时，悲伤才能终结，这光不是由一次经验或者一次一闪而过的领悟点亮的；这种了解始终都在点亮着自己。没人能把它给你——也没有书本、诀窍，老师或者救主能够给你。了解自己就是悲伤的终结。
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